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Unions Suck

By Matt Margolis | December 20, 2005

Indeed.

UPDATE: Awww… the ironworkers are offended…

Topics: General |

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58 Responses to “Unions Suck”

Kahn Says:
December 21st, 2005 at 12:35 am
Agreed. But who do the left leaning people of New York blame? The union or the mayor?
jay Says:
December 21st, 2005 at 1:46 pm
It’ll end soon enough. It happened here in Philly a few months back and the strike lasted exactly one week. They went without a paycheck on Friday and the following Monday they were back at work.
Kahn Says:
December 21st, 2005 at 6:26 pm
Jay - but is it illegal for them to strike in Penn?
Kahn Says:
December 22nd, 2005 at 1:30 am
I think that NYC should just announce that starting tomorrow - if you don’t show up for your shift then consider yourself terminated for breaking the law (or for cause). That means no unemployment. 50,000 new jobs open in New York!

Problem is, it would be rough for a while as the new crew comes up to speed.
todd Says:
December 22nd, 2005 at 6:15 pm
Unions are nothing more than a doormat for organized crime. That’s it! Think about it. You break a few heads and you have control over a huge segment of an entire industry. You simply cannot have positions of power where a few, even one, preside over hundreds and thousands and even tens of thousands of people and their daily pocketbook. Union officials are human and can be made to see certain points of view in a very short amount of time. The idea of unionism is nice and naturally appeals to the workers. As “left” as people think I am, I can’t get past the notion that an owner cannot do whatever he wants with his own business. Granted, it’d be nice if they don’t make their workers work in squalor, and there must be some controls in place. Remember, garment union = Gambino.
Kahn Says:
December 22nd, 2005 at 11:45 pm
Todd,

Q. How many Teamsters does it take to change a light bulb?

A. Seventeen. Ya got a problem with that?

Actually, I think it’s more complicated than organized crime. But I know that’s part of it. Glad to see they’re wrapping this up. Obviously, no government would ever hire ME as their negotiator.
reliapundit Says:
December 24th, 2005 at 2:14 am
Professor Reynolds linked to an article by RYAN SAGER in the NYPOST:

[Sager] noted this morning, the strike opened up a class war — just not the one the union was expecting. “[T]here is a class confrontation of a kind going on — but it’s not between rich and poor. It’s between the working class and what might be called the government-worker class. The gap between the two groups has been growing for a while.”

RELIAPUNDIT ADDAS: that the “government workers” (like NEA teachers, and AFSCME white collar bureaucrats, and SEIU etc) are PAID FROM TAXES and are also HUGE supporters of the Democrat Party. They are perhaps the strongest backers of the party - in money, right after the Left-wing billionaires like Soros, Lewis, and Heinz-Kerry. And they might contribute the most to the Democrats when one takes into account manpower hours during campaigning and their get out the vote efforts.

This is OBVIOUSLY one reason why the Democrats FAVOR BIGGER GOVERNMENT AND INCREASING GOVERNMENT SPENDING: It’s a PAYOFF their supporters.

In this light, it’s OBVIOUS that the “government employeee union”/Democrat Party alignment nothing more than a self-serving “AXIS FOR TAXES” and that this is why the AXIS nearly always favors more government programs and higher taxes: in order to pay for higher wages and more perks for MORE government workers/union members.

(This AXIS has been a Democrat stronghold since the days of Tammany hall, but NEVER before did it so strongly reflect GOVERNMENT WORKERS as opposed to blue-collar workers.)

The GOP, on the other hand, favors LOWER TAXES, CUTTING GOVERNMENT SPENDING AND SHRINKING THE SIZE OF GOVERNMENT. The GOP is increasingly the party of TAXPAYERS, the self-employed and blue-collar workers.

Because there are more taxpayers than “workers who are paid through taxes,” this way of looking at the divide greatly favors the GOP. KEN MEHLMAN: ARE YOU LISTENING!? here’s a campaign slogan: “STOP THE AXIS FOR TAXES. VOTE GOP!”
Bob Kelly Says:
December 25th, 2005 at 7:27 pm
Remember that the next time you need a policeman or fireman, both of which are UNION. Not to mention the next time you watch a sporting event, because all the major sports are also UNION. Dont forget the teachers who educated you, there all UNION too.

And if any of you actually live in New York, remember everytime you look up at all the tall buildings/skyscrapers…every last one of them was built by UNION Ironworkers, and other UNION hands.
Matt Margolis Says:
December 25th, 2005 at 8:37 pm
Bob,

and you know what? Unions are still bad…
Bob Kelly Says:
December 25th, 2005 at 8:56 pm
Good comeback Matt…LOL.
Matt Margolis Says:
December 25th, 2005 at 10:17 pm
well, if you need it explained to you… union workers are usually overpaid, and have no acountibility. Union wages are articificially high, which actually keeps more people out of work.
Bob Kelly Says:
December 25th, 2005 at 11:04 pm
Sure Matt. All the fireman and police have mansions, and summer in the Hamptons. Many of New Yorks finest, cant even afford to live in NYC, they have to live in Jersey. How quickly we forget the heroism displayed on 9/11, by what you would call overpaid individuals. I would call them under paid heroes.
Matt Margolis Says:
December 25th, 2005 at 11:39 pm
Bob, grow up… that’s a sad way to distort the issue. Why don’t you try to defend the unions like those whiners in NY… I have friends who are part of a union and they make ridiculous salaries for their line of work.

Teachers… after they get tenure, they cease to be accountable for their performance..

Unions may have had their usefulness once.. but not anymore..
Terry "limey" Strobel Says:
December 27th, 2005 at 7:09 pm
Matt you seem to think that if union construction stopped in NYC tomorrow that the building cost would fall as the pay we recive wouldn’t be driving the construction cost so high. Well your wrong the prices wouldn’t change the labout would be inferor and they’d just put that much more in there pockets.
As for unions and 9/11 i was there the day it happened i stayed there 5mnths was there for one reason to help recover the people we lost and to get it cleaned up there was talk off Bectal KBR and the likes comming in ,they wern’t needed we know our job and are highly skilled at it and worked everyday making sure no one else died cleaning up someone elses mess. Proud member Local 40 NYC
Randy B Says:
December 27th, 2005 at 7:38 pm
If you value child labor laws, OSHA, and minimum standards for workers, you can thank a union.
Randy B Says:
December 27th, 2005 at 7:54 pm
Unions play a pivotal role both in securing legislated labor protections and rights such as safety and health, overtime, and family/medical leave and in enforcing those rights on the job. Because unionized workers are more informed, they are more likely to benefit from social insurance programs such as unemployment insurance and workers compensation. Unions are thus an intermediary institution that provides a necessary complement to legislated benefits and protections.

Between 1985 and 1995, 522 workers were killed in trench-related mishaps. Of these, 60 died working for union firms while 462 died in non-union employment…

Tell it to the 462 who died that unions are outdated.

Union ironworkers are the most highly skilled at what we do. Here’s why

Name one non-union contractor who’s been doing this for over 100 years.

It takes a three year program to make a journeyman ironworker out of a guy on the street. For most, it’s longer than that. We don’t get any summer vacation.

As an architect, maybe you should pay attention to who’s making your ideas into a reality. My blood and sweat are elements of a structure that you won’t find on any print.

Randy B
Ironworkers Local 8
Randy B Says:
December 27th, 2005 at 8:18 pm
Matt,
If you survived one day of work with me, I don’t think that the word “overpaid” would be forthcoming …
Matt Margolis Says:
December 27th, 2005 at 8:25 pm
Randy, in all seriousness, if i put up a bunch of links to anti-union sources, would you accept them as objective source?
Randy B Says:
December 27th, 2005 at 9:47 pm
Matt,
The trench statistics can be found on OSHA’s website. The statistics wouldn’t even be a thought if it was not for unions looking out for their members’ safety. OSHA wouldn’t be a thought.

If you can find a non-union construction source that has a better training program than the union ironworkers, I’d be most impressed. All trades unions serve an apprenticeship.

If you can find any source (non-union or otherwise) that refutes what I have listed PLEASE share it.

Objective or not, the truth is available for any who wish to see it.

Those who know little about the Labor Union’s history and badmouth it to this day really annoy me. Unions are not the only ones who have benefitted from unions. Chances are, if you were working in a sweatshop to supplement your family’s income, you wouldn’t have had a chance to finish high school, let alone think about college.
MIKE Says:
December 31st, 2005 at 6:33 pm
TO MATT,
AS FAR AS THE UNION STRIKE HERE IN THE CITY..BOTH SIDES LET THEIR EGO GET IN THE WAY AND THE REST OF US SUFFERED HERE IN NYC FOR THEIR PIG-HEADEDNESS!

MATT YOU SEEM TO BLOG ON AND ON(BLAH BLAH BLAH) ABOUT THINGS WITHOUT DOING ANY OF YOUR OWN RESEARCH OR ASKING YOUR OWN QUESTIONS. YOU ALSO TALK IN SUCH GENERALITIES. SUCH AS:”well, if you need it explained to you… union workers are usually overpaid,(REALLY? HOW DO YOU KNOW?) and have no acountibility.,(REALLY? HOW DO YOU KNOW?) Union wages are articificially high,,(REALLY? HOW DO YOU KNOW?) which actually keeps more people out of work.”-MATT MARGOLIS
TELL US ALL ONCE AGAIN HOW YOU CAME TO ANY OF YOUR CONCLUSIONS AND INSIGHTS–REMEBER AS YOU PUT IT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT ACCOUNTABILITY, THAT INCLUDES YOURSELF TOO RIGHT?
MIKE
Kahn Says:
December 31st, 2005 at 6:44 pm
Mike,

THE SHIFT KEY TAKES THE CAPS OFF! OK?

Oh, and RandyB - The Navy, Army, and Marine Corps train pretty good construction workers without a Union. And, as a matter of fact - so apparently does the nations of El Salvador and Mexico. The training “program” you mention is pretty intertwined with union rules and salaries. Are you sure the training couldn’t exist without the Unions?
Randy B Says:
January 2nd, 2006 at 6:10 pm
Hemets to hard hats

The Unions are extremely supportive of soldiers - see the link provided.

Okay, so your non-union equivalent consists of an entire government? Hmmm, doesn’t seem to help prove your point, but, rather strengthens mine.

The Armed Forces is one area where OSHA has no say. Much of the government work is contracted out through Union contractors. If they are so good, why is this needed to be done?

The training does not exist outside of the union. A percentage of my salary goes directly into the training fund.

If a nonunion contractor is going to pay his worker the least amount possible, what makes you think that he’s going to shell out any greenbacks to train his guys?

I’ve seen how Mexicans put in rebar. It’s done at night. (when it’s cooler) They use tiny Toyota pickups to transport the stuff around while it’s nearly dragging on the street because it’s too long for the truck bed.

I’ve been in the military. I’ve worked non-union. I’ve worked union. There is no comparison. Unions are the best.

Where does your experience come from, Kahn?
Kahn Says:
January 5th, 2006 at 12:13 am
RandyB -

I actually have mixed feelings about unions. I don’t think that pointing at a monopoly (in some areas) and saying - see they train people - is completely fair. But, I don’t think unions should be abolished either. They build buildings, roads, houses, and bridges in areas without unions - right? So, I guess they are not actually “necessary”. But that is over simplification.

I do know that Union workers at Colt struck for two months during the Viet nam war - shutting down M-16 production. And, that the M-16’s from the Colt line were found to be much more shoddily made than the ArmaLite (Non-union) guns.

I know that here in Virginia, the new Wilson bridge project was almost stopped when the previous (DEM) governor of Maryland insisted on Union labor. That would have nearly doubled the cost. Our governor told Maryland that it was free to pay however much it wanted on it’s side of the river - and the plan was dropped.

I have also seen Union labor at a major aircraft plant and at several railroads protect some of the laziest people I have ever met. I have also seen them drive small manufacturing plants out of business.

But again - whatever. I still have mixed feelings on them.
Randy B Says:
January 5th, 2006 at 7:28 pm
correction:
As far as laziness, I just fired a guy last week for that. The instances that you listed seemed to be of the shop trade variety.

“union” should be substituted for trade.
Randy B Says:
January 6th, 2006 at 5:52 pm
As proof of how employers will take advantage of workers, look where the jobs are going. Check out some of the conditions.
Kahn Says:
January 7th, 2006 at 12:56 am
Randy,

The Railroads are UNION in capital letters man. Come on. Along with the miners, they invented Unions in this country.

You fired a guy. Does that mean that I didn’t see lazy people protected? Nope.

But with the last item you hit it. The economy has become very much a “world” economy. That means that steel workers in Pittburgh have to compete with workers in China and Japan. The many many cloth and clothing mills in New England and North Carolina (that I know of personally) are good examples of this. They fell twenty years ago.

But, what does this mean? If the Unions hold out for a particular benefits package, or a certain pay scale, or whatever… the cost is going to make it’s way into the price of the products they make, ship, or deliver. But, unions don’t operate in a vacuum and the world economy will not support this. If a factory in Mexico, Indonesia, or China can build an equivalent product - then they will. The problem is, in many cases they CAN build products that are just as good.

What is YOUR solution for this? Because honestly, I don’t have one.
Randy B Says:
January 7th, 2006 at 6:02 pm
FYI-The last mine incident took place in a non-union mine.

Well, when everyone is left fighting for service jobs, they can thank those who didn’t support products made in the US.

I’ll spend extra money on union made products. I make my money in the US, and, I spend it on American products. (to the best of my ability) For me, it’s that simple.

When people don’t have a good paying job, and, don’t have enough money to eat, how good do you think a Toyota will taste?

Look at what kind of crap Wal-Mart is pulling. Near to where I live, they are using prison labor to build a store.

Wal-Mart is the future if we let it be that way.

My union is the best at what we do. My job is pretty secure until I decide to retire. Business is booming in construction. I could sit on my butt and not care less about those who will be the future “cart-givers/welcomers” at Wal-Mart, but, I don’t.

Truth be told, most people are in for a rude awakening if they are only concerned about having more money in their wallet today.

If everyone makes a fair wage, they can afford to spend. If non-union companies pay their people less while lining their own pockets, it’s pretty easy to see that the rich get richer while the rest get nothing.

About that railroad worker - what was his job? I don’t envision their job as really being backbreaking in nature.

If you don’t have a problem with kids not being able to go to school in Malaysia because they have to work, keep on buying those Malaysian products. Just don’t complain when your kids can’t get an education either my friend. Usually we learn from history…
Randy B Says:
January 8th, 2006 at 9:36 am
Just got an e-mail from a friend who set me straight about railroad work. His father was one. (may he rest in peace) It’s definitely work. It seems the man’s father had back problems due to this line of work, so, I retract my earlier comment about it’s lack of being “backbreaking”. I think I may have been picturing the guys who ride around on the trains all day. (I’m happy I helped my own ignorance due to this subject discussion - with the help of my favorite Chicagoan)

Did you spend the whole day watching this man, or, is there a chance he could have been taking a break? Unions do allow for this. I’m pretty sure that State laws do as well.

There’s times when I’ve been waiting for the next piece of iron to get sent up when anyone watching me could claim that I’m being lazy. It takes time for the crane to swing down to the ground, and, for the ground guys to hook it up.

Could he have been waiting for a call to tell him where exactly the track needed to be fixed? Might he have needed to wait for a train to pass before being able to safely work on the track?

More than a few options come to mind. He might have just been lazy for all that I know, but, I think that there are many other possibilities as well…
Randy B Says:
January 8th, 2006 at 10:45 pm
Railroad Workers

(three out of four railroad workers are union)
Andrew R Says:
February 9th, 2006 at 12:56 am
Excuse my French, by the union is a big crock of shit. Boiling, steaming shit. And all of you that try to use what is has accomplished in the past to blanket what bitches make it up today can eat it.
Randy B Says:
February 11th, 2006 at 11:36 pm
Great argument, you ignoramus.

How about trying to write something that makes a little bit of sense?
BILL Says:
March 24th, 2006 at 6:51 pm
ALL YOU CRYBABY’S AND HATERS ON UNIONS,,YOU DONT REALISE THE ROADS YOU DRIVE ON AND THE OFFICE DESK YOU SIT IN WAS PROBABLY BUILT UNION,,,IRONWORKERS,,,,WE BUST OUR ASSES SO YOU GUYS CAN SIT IN COMFORT AND EXPAND FREEWAYS SO YOU GUYS DONT CRY ABOUT SITTING IN TRAFFIC,,,GO BITE A BONE….IRONWORKER LOCAL 229
John F. Says:
April 26th, 2006 at 8:01 pm
If it wasnt for the unions frighting for what we have and enjoy today there would be no Labor Day. So next time your off for labor day enjoying your time with your family , thank the union.
Carpenters Local 608 ,NYC.
John L Says:
September 20th, 2006 at 1:26 am
Union labor is not necessarily synonymous with quality. This is especially true for those who want more $$$ for doing less work.
David Says:
December 2nd, 2006 at 3:01 pm
God bless you gentlmen for speaking out against unions.
I have some personal experience with them. I remember working as a contract engineer for the local GM assembly plant. I actually got paid less money per hour than the assembly workers! “Holy cow,” I thought, “why the heck did I even bother going to college and getting a degree?” One day I was investigating a problem with a component and I was looking through some parts in a storage rack. I GM employee - I didn’t know him - approached me and just blurted out “GM managers are a buch of m&*#erf*(kers.” I was completely startled, but regained my composure and asked why he thought that. His reply: “Because they hired YOU and they never asked any of us if we wanted your job.” I was stunned at this gross act of complete ignorance. Here was a 40-something year old man who could not realize that it required an engineering degree to obtain my job AND that I got paid LESS than he did!
Later on that year (in 1998), GM UAW union went on strike in Michigan, effectively shutting down the entire GM organization in North America. The unions circulated a rumor that GM management was hoping to “thin the ranks” by forcing GM workers to commit suicide when they couldn’t pay their bills. The unions were urging workers not to kill themselves out of financial hardship. This would be hilarious if it weren’t true. These completely uneducated, high school dropout, 45-year old men who had never worked anywhere else their entire lives, who never watched the news, who never picked up a newspaper, who just wallowed in their complete ignorance of the world… these men actually BELEIVED the union message warning against GM’s “suicide” plan! These same stupid, gullable malcontents also made more money than I did as an engineer.
Obviously, by using a few 25-cent words, I doubt that any union worker could even read or comprehend my comment.
Thanks again for your post and this thread.
David Says:
December 2nd, 2006 at 3:06 pm
Oh, I almost forgot the best part, I live in Oklahoma City. That GM plant I’m describing? Yeah, well, um… GM shut it down this year. All of those union idiots are now wondering how they will make their house payment, their car payment, their truck payment, their boat and jet ski and 4-wheeler and motorhome payment, and all the other crap that they can afford that I can’t afford.
Meanwhile, my engineering degree and I are doing just fine and enjoy excellent job security. Perhaps I’m just a capitalist pig for saying this, but I’m convinced that society needs engineers more than it needs an uneducated monkey to sit on a stool and screw a doohickie into a thingamajig all day long. But hey, what do I know?
David Says:
December 2nd, 2006 at 3:15 pm
One more comment for all you union folks out there who are obviously going to be offended by my large dose of reality:
Yes, your strong back and muscles helped to build this country. But not a one of you ever created a single job for yourselves. No union ever created a single freakin’ job. Companies create jobs. So while I can drive a truck, lift a box, and drive a forklift, YOU cannot manage a business, start a company, or design the freakin’ forklift. Why? Because while you sat in the back of the class and threw spitballs at me in school, I was actually learning and studying. You “won” the muscle race, but you utterly failed in the intelligence race. Now your entire livelihood depends on your ability to leech off of the payroll of your companies. You are only secure as long as your company is secure. You don’t want to admit it, you macho-manly-men, but you NEEEEED the company. Your life depends on the company. You can’t live without the company. And guess what? When you crap all over the company, you lose your freakin’ job. There’s your steaming pile of reality, gentlemen. Bon apetit!
Jeff Says:
December 10th, 2006 at 8:37 am
That last point is definitely right on the money. I am an engineer and worked my butt off in college to obtain one the hardest undergraduate degrees there is. Only to come out of school, climb the engineering ranks for almost a decade now and then realize that the union force at my place of employment are getting paid the same, if not more, than I do. The average union wage at my place of employment in the midwest is about $32 per hour. They work unskilled jobs and have the same insecure union worker mentality as well. I have a couple of friends that work at UPS, and they have the same mentality. They have to let you know how much they are making per hour to carry a box. Every time I talk to one of them, it always has to be mentioned at some point how much $ they are pulling in working 12 hours a day. One of them, years ago, was making $27 per hour to hose off trucks. That’s it. That’s all he did for 2 years was wash the brown trucks. But if had the opportunity to do what I do, or be one of those guys, I would stay where I am at. As an engineer, there is a market for me. I can go someplace else to work and get a salary raise doing so. I can start my own small company with the skills I’ve obtained, or be a highly compensated self employed contractor. My salary will only keep going up whether I stay where I am or not. But as a union worker, they are stuck where they are at. Once the company goes away, you go away. You’re done. You have to go somewhere else for another union job and start all over again at the bottom of the payscale behind some retarded dyslexic highschool dropout. Assuming you can even find a job. The only secure places of employment for union workers these days seems to be either the post office or UPS. One of my buddies left his union job at UPS to go to college and become something else. I asked him why he did that since he would be making good $ at UPS. He told me, “I want to do something else with my life other than work overtime every day at an unskilled job delivering packages. One can only carry a box so many ways”.
Anonymous Says:
January 16th, 2007 at 7:42 pm
I found this blog entry by typing “unions suck” into a search engine. Why did I do that?

Because I am producing a series of conference videos in Las Vegas. Because in this casino the union has a monopoly on labor at the casino, I have to either pay $75 per hour for a union cameraman (without equipment) or pay a $75 per hour fee for a camera shadow, ostensibly for safety reasons. So I’m stuck hiring union guys. (I have no idea if I’ll like them or not.)

I’ll pay $600 a day before renting equipment (another $200 a day or so) compared to $400 or $500 a day I could pay to a non-union cameraman with his own equipment.

As a consequence, I had to significantly increase costs on my little production (by about $4,000 over the original $15,000 estimate), cutting into my thin profit margin. As a consequence, the client is unhappy and quite possibly will not film again in the future.

To add insult to injury, we have to film for two hours on a different day and must pay a four hour minimum.

This is plainly unfair to me as well as to the guy not privileged or not wanting to be in a union who I can’t give a job to. You can imagine how this makes me feel about unions. It makes me think that they suck.
Anonymous Says:
January 26th, 2007 at 1:13 am
Our little film shoot is over and I wanted to follow up for anyone reading this thread.

Specifically, I wanted to comment on some of the statements above about how qualified union workers are.

We had six operators working on our crew. Three were great but three made basic errors that may have compromised some of the footage. Quite simply, they didn’t know how to operate their cameras.

While some/many/most union workers surely ply their craft with skill, not all do. Of course, because they’re union, they can’t be fired.

If you are a union member, you should consider that the effective inability to fire unqualified workers is a bitter, bitter pill for employers to swallow.

No one will begrudge you asking for a lot of money so long as you earn it.
lg23k Says:
April 6th, 2007 at 8:57 pm
After living in Detroit for so long I can identify w/ the theme of this website. The UAW has managed to destroy three major automobile companies that have been around for close to 100 years. The primary reason why this is happening is because the Big Three (now the Big 2 and whoever buys Chrysler) have been bled dry by the union. Instead of being able to invest money into new technologies that would allow them to compete with the likes of Toyota, Detroit automakers are forced pay hefty wages to union workers. The stigma that currently exists about unreliable American cars can somewhat be attributed to the UAW. The image of the redneck union worker drunk off his a$$ at noon working on a Malibu has stopped many a potential buyer from spending money at a Chevy dealership. That’s of course not to say that the unions are the only problem at American car companies, (Top heavy management and unwillingness to adapt to new processes are just two of the many problems)but they are a big part of the reason why Michigan, which has never endured the aftermath of a hurricane, has an economy that is somewhat worse than that of the worst areas of Louisiana.
rclm26 Says:
April 24th, 2007 at 11:56 pm
Well it finally happened, Toyota overtook GM in the first quarter of 2007 in global output of vehicles. I guess a company not OVERBURDENED with outragous salaries for their union employees has enough finances left over to REINVEST (not line their pockets) those monies into the infastructure of the company. This inturn means better output, training, quality, and PAY for the company as a whole. I work in grocery retail at the largest non-union, privately owned supermarket in the country and our business and finances are doing absolutely GREAT - because we are non-union!! A friend of mine worked out in California and was told more or less that if she wasn’t in the union her pay would suck. I asked her what the benefits of being in her union was - her response “Nothing, I paid $ per week in union dues and never saw anything from it”. Remember the 2 month stike/lock-out in Southern Califonia grocery stores? Union “negotiators” calling a strike so the companies would take even more of a burden with health care, benefits, and retirement packages. All while the workers (keep in mind these are grocery store workers) were making at least $20/hr. Unions were created to protect workers (which was a great idea) in the 20’s-60’s. Most companies now adays understand their obligations to their workers and by law can not take blatant advantage of their workers. Unions are outdated and in many cases cause businesses to fold after they can not pay their inflated salaries.
joe Schmoe Says:
June 4th, 2007 at 11:58 am
Here’s another example of how a union “helped” their employees. Several years ago workers at the Newark Airport Monorail were convinced by the local elevators union that they, despite being at the most high school educated, should be making at least $30 an hour. A strike ensued with all the things you normally equate with a strike-verbal abuse and harassment of non-striking workers as well as vandalism of company and private property. They even went so far as to cut key communication cables on the train control system, stranding hundreds of passengers. And what did the workers get for their efforts? Nothing. They were replaced and had to find new jobs.
harvey Says:
July 15th, 2007 at 10:26 pm
Dont say all ironworkers are upset at ya. I am a none union Ironworkes that travels nation wide. I have been picketed and threatened by union ironworkers did it stop me from working no. Do i get insurance yes, do i get benifits yes, do I have to pay some union BA’s caddy payment no. Sounds like a great life to me.
Bill1USMC Says:
July 18th, 2007 at 11:35 pm
Last year my company posted record fourth quarter earnings. JD Power & Associates rated us number 1 in customer satisfaction, a first for a telecommunications company. My company responded by offering my union a contract (best last final) that cut wages and benefits. I love my work, I work hard and I work long. Some weeks I put in 50 hours and some 100 hrs. I work in the rain, snow, heat, weekends, holidays, days and nights. Unlike the guy that went straight to college after high school, I chose to serve my country for 6 years before earning a degree in electrical engineering. Sitting behind a desk didn’t work for me so I went to work. Man work. Work that someone who got hit in the head with spitballs and didn’t kick some ass could never do, but I could do your job. Not all things are perfect with unions. Some are flat out crooks. My company’s CEO makes 11m a year plus stock options and a buy out plan. If I worked every hour of every day for that same year my pay would be 900% less than what he would make in 6 months. Now he wants me to work for less. Sound fair? Hey I’m a flag waving conservative capitalist pig. I believe in business, entrepreneurship and working hard at anything you do. I give 8 hour for 8 hours. But there’s always going to be the guy that needs to make 11m a year even though he hasn’t invented a damn thing. I guess when people like those are gone there wont be a need for unions. And then those that choose to ride a desk might even make more than the workers. Until then, like it or not, union are the only protection workers have from slave labor but even that’s changing.
Skip Says:
August 26th, 2007 at 8:09 am
I work as an operations manager in a large manufacturer in the defense industry. This is not your normal manufacturing environment – we have nice factory floors with air conditioning and very clean! Most of the place is clean room, so it is a dream to work in.

The union operators make more money that our supervisors and junior engineers. When we try to enforce the contract (break times, lunch periods, overtime policy, etc.) the union files grievances, and the company losses thousands on attorney fees, and overtime trying to keep the company running. The union typically works 6.5 hours out of a 12 hour shift – the contract states 10.5 out of 12. We are unable to keep customers due to our terrible productivity and rising costs, and the union will not help us implement lean manufacturing to redesign our business. Our business will probably die in the next few years because of the union. There is no long-term strategic vision with the union – only what have you done for me today. Of course, we don’t have people working for us like Bill.
Alexia Says:
August 30th, 2007 at 10:31 am
The union at UPS really doesn’t help their workers much. My friend’s husband is a driver there, and he was involved in an accident (on the job) which involved a severe head trauma.

Per the Union’s “wonderful” deal, UPS fired him. If and when he gets better, he can reapply at UPS.

The money that people pay in union dues would be better spent on their 401K plans. The main agenda of the Union is to protect the Union’s income.
Turd Ferguson Says:
September 7th, 2007 at 7:01 pm
Yup, unions suck it pretty bad. I really love seeing that fun little deduction every week so that all of the yokels can have beer at their very important “meeting” at the moose lodge and give my money away to politicians that I don’t like. I love there little “campaigns”, too. There’s nothing smarter than forcing a bunch of people to belong to a political organization that they don’t want to be in (i.e.–USSR?) hum….
roland Says:
September 24th, 2007 at 3:24 am
Great blog. Unions suck big time. What started out as a good thing back in the early 1900’s has has gone bad and is now the bane of american manufacturing. Some unions are better than others such as the skilled unions like the IAM, but unions like the UAW are filled with over-paid, uneducated/unskilled workers (if you can call them workers) with bad attitudes. Go in an try to improve the processes to make the company more competitive, and then start the threats, slow downs, etc.

Wake-up UAW! The US economy is sucking wind, and you’re a big part of the reason why. It’s too expensive to manufacture here because you expect to get paid the same amount of money as those who have educations. If that’s what you want, get off your ass, make the sacrafice, get an education, and then come back and help improve our manufacturing capabilities instead of doing everything possible to slow it down.

You want the big three to build more cars here in the US??? Then give them a reason to. You’re so damn short sighted! These companies aren’t trying to screw you anymore like they were in the 1900’s, but if you really feel that way, then get off your ass and go get a job somewhere else! Oh, I’m sorry, that’s right, you can’t because you don’t have any skills or an education. So instead of bitching how bad you have it, ponder that if you can and perhaps you’ll start to realize you don’t have it so bad afterall.
Nick Says:
September 26th, 2007 at 9:32 am
My Father came to this country 55 years ago looking to better him self and build a future in the land of opportunity. He started working for a local contractor crew. It was a small operation at first but grew quite large over the years. He was doing just fine getting quite a bit of work and the customers were happy. They eventually became union. My father did not understand all of the union rules and necessity of the union at first. He was old school Italian knowing that a full day’s work is a days pay. The bosses said do this…and you did exactly that. They worked hard and were proud of there quality work. They started to lose work shortly after they unionized as the workers were to be paid more so the company had to charge more for the job. Yet the workers got less in there pay due to union dues. And less workers were on the job as committee members now were in meetings most of the day. They pulled the work slow down routine when issues came up and started to take longer breaks as they got used to the power of many. They pulled several other union tricks that were passed on by the “union leadership”. This was all a ploy to stick it to the customer and the company owner in order to leverage there positions. My Father did not agree with these tactics and saw no need for this. He did not vote for the union and in turn was treated poorly by the other union members that once believed in the same work ethics as my Dad. He just wanted a good days pay for a good days work. The job safety or job security or job work environment was not any better. It was actually worse. They now had committee members who did not work; they just sat around talking about how they could stick it to the company and stirred up the men. The committee met in bars and hotel rooms for meetings and drank beer and ate take out all on the union dollar dues. The owner was forced to close his company and they were all out of work. What a wonderful idea it was to vote the union in. My Dad became self emloyed and vowed never to work with or for the unions..ever!
I tried not to let this experience that my Dad went through taint my feelings on the union. However, after working for many years for some companies that were unionized and some that were not, I find myself looking at the same bull my Dad put up with and much worse!! As a Maintenance Tech, Engineer, Supervisor, Technical Advisor and now Test Technician I have had the opportunity to work along side of some fine individuals. In all most every case the union workers seemed brain washed and pigheaded to the point of them risking a company folding than working with the company. A company that fed there family for years, that paid for there houses and cars and boats and children’s college and insurance and uniforms and in all the cases the company would bend over backward to make the work environment clean, safe and positive despite the union efforts to bring it to its knees.
They would strike for more money and less work, they would make deals to get there drunken brothers off report, they would push for No drug testing in a forklift hazzard environment..??
I was in several unions and know first hand the trickery and bull crap that goes on in the union office and at the union hall. I would do my best to support the positive work that was involved in negotiating. However, if I questioned or expressed concern in the shifty evil and morally indecent tactics used by the union in order to stick it to the company; I was shunned and called a scab my equipment was damaged and I was treated like an enemy at war time and even threatened (including my family). These were guys I worked with and supported for years. No, I do not like unions and do not believe they are needed today. They were the reason why two companies I worked for in the past had to close. They are the reason why the company I work for now is in trouble and will no doubt be closing this winter.
The union would hand out black shirts that say “fight the man” “down with company rule” even though the company had a white t-shirt uniform company supplied. They pull that crap during a customer tour and wonder why they did not get the new buisness. Duh!! One of the shirts said “fighting machinist union”. A customer that was touring the plant asked “what are you fighting”, the union worker said “the company and management”. Nice answer dumb ass. I’m sure the potential customer was confident his buisness would do well there..Duh!! I wonder why that buisness went some place els..??
I had supervised several hundred union employees over the years. I have been in both seats..union and management..I worked side by side with many union and non union. I negotiated for both sides. I can not count on one hand the number of good hard working helpful and positive minded union individuals that I came across. That is sad and an example of the union standard today…. wake up you dumb ass IAM, UAW, IBEW, etc…
stop the union Says:
September 28th, 2007 at 12:24 pm
Right now foxwoods resort casino is fighting the uaw from getting in.I think this is a worthy fight.I work there now.Of course we all want more.But a union will hurt more than help.I ask people why union?.Most just think that its a fix -all.I havent heard one good thing that getting them in here would do.I feel that they want to get in a get some $$ from the workers.Sure the casino makes alot of money, but all in all they are fair to the workers.Most of the union lovers are people who have never really did any hard labor.I say get them outside,digging a ditch, of anything something,.Then lets see how tough it is working in a.c. all summer, and heat all winter.there a soft.figh the uaw.All they want is your union fees.
mike Says:
October 30th, 2007 at 2:45 pm
I’m working on a job in center city philadelphia. A small job at that for a customer I know and have worked with before. We are there for our customers when we are needed at 3am for an emergency fix. Our customer is a restauranteur by the way. Somehow Union guys found out we were working there and have been hassling us for days. the restaurant cannnot be closed long because of loss of business and other reasons. These lazy idiots are standing around hassling us for a a job that they couldn’t even imagine completing in the time frame we are given. These morons would be having coffee breaks , long lunch breaks .. and over all.. end up doing the job wrong anyway. What a joke. They can keep on hassling.. cuz we will be working anyway.. what a waste of time!
Brooks Says:
November 29th, 2007 at 5:29 pm
I agree with you completely. Presently I am a recalled Mechanic with American Airlines and represented by the AFL/CIO affiliate union TWU. TWU is in bed with the evil Corporation and I have felt the devastating blow of organized crime that is allowed by our Democracy. It promotes laziness, tardiness, and lack of loyalty (except for those who prefer the first two characteristics I mentioned). Would you be able to refer me a lawyer to go against AA and TWU. Any direction would be greatly appreciated.
Tim Says:
December 6th, 2007 at 8:43 pm
Well I’m a member of IRONWORKERS local 290 Dayton Ohio and i think there is a need for unions. all you people bashing us. Well in 10 years when you can buy a car or food for your family. Because all our goods and shit is made over seas or buy cheap labor coming to the u.s.a. remember unions were there to fight for you but you all pushed them out tell your kids your sorry they cant eat
mel Says:
December 19th, 2007 at 5:10 pm
all of you union boys are a joke you say you been working at this for 100 years what one of you are 118 years old just anouther bunch of union crap i been working steel for 24 years and never had to buy a job yet so keep buying your little jobs sending your little bit of money to the states you fools
Dan Says:
January 16th, 2008 at 11:47 am
To Bob-
Ahh, you can still build skyscrapers, teach children and have professional sporting events without unions. What’s your point?
Dan O. Says:
January 21st, 2008 at 1:04 pm
Glad to see you’re still getting comments after 2 years.

Hey Union Whores: Union or non-Union have NOTHING to do with skill sets.

Just read the comments from the majoruty of Union Joe’s who commented here and you get the mental agility of the average union worker.
den Says:
March 5th, 2008 at 8:08 am
Unions basically exploit their members to get what they want from them with abosolutely no intent on properly representing them. SEIU is among the worst. See, I used to work for SEIU and I know what we were told to do with out members. We were to collect political action, tell them this was the only way they could really change their lives (BTW politics is extremely important and more folks should vote) all with the intent of filling andy sterns need for a cabinet post… I mean folks pay union dues to be represented right?
BTW… SEIU is the worst hypocrit around…they absolutely refuse to allow their own staff to form unions and be represented… a few locals have them but, most locals would be put into trusteehip or disolved before staff union could be formed… they form call centers to “provide better representation” however, it is a cheaper way so more money can be spent on politics…..

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Unions Suck

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